| jeremiah_ | hello one and all | 13:46 |
|---|---|---|
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| keesj | Hi | 14:13 |
| jeremiah_ | hi kees | 14:14 |
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| keesj | I can do two things today , ask all kinds of stupid question or just be silten. very hard choice | 14:16 |
| Stskeeps | asking stupid questions creates discussion, silence creates none :P | 14:18 |
| keesj | indeed , but it's not like there is a clear winner between silence and noise | 14:21 |
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| keesj | the choice I made is clear :p | 14:27 |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 14:28 |
| Stskeeps | how long till the meeting anyway? | 14:28 |
| jeremiah_ | I always forget, so I show up early. :) | 14:29 |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 14:29 |
| keesj | one our, but I need to pick up kids and such in between | 14:31 |
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| Jaffa | 30 minutes | 15:01 |
| jeremiah_ | 251 | 15:05 |
| jeremiah_ | 25! | 15:05 |
| Jaffa | 251 would be handy, give me plenty of time to sort out work issues | 15:12 |
| keesj | 251 internet beats perhaps | 15:12 |
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| Jaffa | Right. Who do we have? | 15:29 |
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| * Jaffa gives it a couple more minutes | 15:29 | |
| jeremiah_ | Hello! Jeremiah here. | 15:29 |
| timsamoff | Hi everyone. | 15:30 |
| * Stskeeps is around but not participating actively. | 15:30 | |
| jeremiah_ | Stskeeps: You lurker. :P | 15:30 |
| X-Fade | here | 15:30 |
| sjgadsby | I'm another lurker. | 15:31 |
| JamieBennett | I'm around | 15:31 |
| andre___ | same here. | 15:31 |
| bergie | hi all | 15:31 |
| * qwerty12 sets mode +lurking qwerty12 | 15:31 | |
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| tekojo | Hi all | 15:32 |
| Jaffa | No Patrik or Ferenc (yet?) | 15:32 |
| jeremiah_ | Or Daniel? | 15:32 |
| Jaffa | danielwilms is here | 15:32 |
| bergie | Patrik isn't at the office yet but I can mostly speak for him I guess | 15:32 |
| Jaffa | OK | 15:32 |
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| * qole yawns | 15:32 | |
| Jaffa | We'll start then. | 15:32 |
| Jaffa | Agenda item #1: review of March 09 items | 15:33 |
| danielwilms | I'm here... | 15:34 |
| Jaffa | http://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo.org_Sprints/March_09 is the basis | 15:34 |
| Jaffa | And we'll work through in the order in the agenda. | 15:34 |
| Jaffa | Quim's update is http://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo.org_Sprints/April_09/Meeting#Quim_Gil.27s_status_report | 15:34 |
| Jaffa | First item will carry over with a due date of the end of this sprint (start of May 2009) | 15:34 |
| Jaffa | Items #2 & #3 will go back into the backlog | 15:35 |
| Jaffa | Anyone with anything to add on maemo.nokia.com, community l10n or open source proof points? | 15:35 |
| Jaffa | The next one is Patrik. bergie can you give updates on "Karma for applications" and "Finalize design and plan for karma for applications"? | 15:36 |
| qole | Sorry | 15:36 |
| qole | I did a little blurb on the "talk" page of that wiki page | 15:36 |
| * timsamoff has son on lap. | 15:37 | |
| bergie | Jaffa: I think those two are sort of duplicates... obviously the plan needs to be before "Karma for Applications" can be a task | 15:37 |
| qole | (open source proof points) | 15:37 |
| timsamoff | qole: Thanks. I'll look. | 15:37 |
| bergie | Jaffa: Hirvinen just called me... he is sick today but will come here... so maybe we can do his action points a bit later? | 15:37 |
| Jaffa | bergie: OK, will do - thanks | 15:37 |
| X-Fade | I've discussed implementation details with Hirvinen when I was over there. | 15:37 |
| X-Fade | He promissed to post a plan.. | 15:38 |
| Jaffa | qole: Thanks - we'll consider it dropped from Quim and see if anyone (you? ;-)) wants to pick it up as a new task for April | 15:38 |
| Jaffa | ferenc isn't here - so we'll skip "Define what is needed to get git up on maemo.org" | 15:39 |
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| bergie | regarding his point, see this qaiku update: http://www.qaiku.com/channels/show/maemo/view/1de1e671dbbb46c1e6711deb73c5d9b6e7bd49cd49c/ | 15:39 |
| jeremiah_ | git is up, so is creating www pages in git on garage | 15:39 |
| bergie | (git on garage) | 15:39 |
| Jaffa | Yeah, so it's unclear what's remaining on that task. | 15:40 |
| tekojo | Jaffa: git's mostly up, now the work is in svn -> git tools | 15:40 |
| X-Fade | Jaffa: Some garage integration is still left. | 15:40 |
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| Jaffa | Right. Can't commit a due date on his behalf, but a task in a sprint should be clearly defined and be achievable in the 4 weeks | 15:41 |
| jeremiah_ | It'd be kinda cool if git got into extras too. | 15:41 |
| * timsamoff agrees with jeremiah_ | 15:41 | |
| JamieBennett | http://www.qaiku.com/channels/show/maemo/view/1de1e671dbbb46c1e6711deb73c5d9b6e7bd49cd49c/ | 15:41 |
| JamieBennett | doh wrong window | 15:41 |
| Jaffa | "git for maemo.org" seems a bit vague - and so this sprint should have like 4 tasks "svn -> git tooling", "garage integration" etc. | 15:42 |
| qwerty12 | jeremiah_, someone's built packages (not in Extras): http://internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=275368 (source packages are there) | 15:42 |
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| jeremiah_ | qwerty12: Ah, cool | 15:42 |
| Jaffa | Hirvinen: thanks for making it :) | 15:42 |
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| Jaffa | Anything to add on git? | 15:43 |
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| Jaffa | We'll move on to bergie then (two tasks shared with Niels which are also duplicates) :) | 15:43 |
| Hirvinen | Sorry, forgot about this(at home sleeping off a flu+fever combo) | 15:44 |
| Hirvinen | Andmy connection's laggy as hell | 15:44 |
| Hirvinen | anyway, happened last month: | 15:44 |
| qole | Hirvinen: just got over cold+flu, it is awful. | 15:44 |
| bergie | Jaffa: and it should be Niels/Lauri not Niels/Henri :-) | 15:44 |
| bergie | (we did some internal task swapping) | 15:44 |
| Jaffa | If it's internal task swapping, and lauri's not here - you're still responsible ;-) | 15:45 |
| * Jaffa plays pin-the-tail-on-the-owner | 15:45 | |
| Hirvinen | Got caught up with off-sprint stuff, namely karma stuff for the election | 15:45 |
| bergie | Jaffa: yes... I can speak for him I suppose :-) | 15:45 |
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| Hirvinen | (and soon improved sender detection for emails should be in the online systems as well so people get karma for mails they send bettter) | 15:46 |
| Jaffa | We should do Hirvinen first so he can get back to bed. | 15:46 |
| Jaffa | Hirvinen: cool, anything to commit to for April; and due date for "karma for applications" please | 15:46 |
| Jaffa | Happy to receive via email if you need to think | 15:47 |
| Hirvinen | I've thought a bit about a good solution for the app karma,but no ready proposal, so move that to this sprint | 15:47 |
| Jaffa | With the deliverable being a plan, or an implementation? | 15:47 |
| Hirvinen | I'll send my proposal this week, and barring no-go reply from Niels within a week from that, I'll implement | 15:48 |
| Jaffa | OK, thanks | 15:48 |
| Jaffa | Moving on to bergie... | 15:49 |
| bergie | so, AFAIK the Midgard part of implementing the new design is done | 15:49 |
| bergie | and there is the public review of newstyle.maemo.org going on right now | 15:50 |
| bergie | X-Fade has done some stuff with MediaWiki templates as well | 15:50 |
| X-Fade | Well, there are still some dynloads to be implemented.. | 15:50 |
| bergie | X-Fade: the "new users" list? | 15:50 |
| X-Fade | people block on front page, latest posts etc on community etc.. | 15:51 |
| bergie | ok... so 80%? | 15:51 |
| X-Fade | Yeah, some minor things. But still a bit of work. | 15:52 |
| bergie | did you talk with Lauri about whether those can be done this week? | 15:52 |
| X-Fade | He said so last week. | 15:53 |
| Jaffa | What's the defined end-goal for this sprint (and/or a different end date committed) | 15:53 |
| Jaffa | ? | 15:53 |
| X-Fade | Jaffa: Done for the end of this Sprint. | 15:53 |
| X-Fade | And earlier is better ;) | 15:54 |
| Jaffa | :) | 15:54 |
| bergie | I have couple of additional Midgard-related tasks for April when we get that far in the agenda | 15:54 |
| Jaffa | X-Fade: with "done" including midgard (incl. download) and Mediawiki? | 15:54 |
| Jaffa | Anything else on newstyle or shall we move on to your other task, X-Fade, "plan to redesign downloads & add functionality"? | 15:55 |
| X-Fade | Jaffa: Well the task is for maemo.org. But all others will follow after www.maemo.org is done. | 15:55 |
| bergie | Jaffa: I think newstyle should have new action points like "deploy newstyle to garage" and "deploy newstyle to bugzilla" etc | 15:55 |
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| Jaffa | bergie: agreed | 15:56 |
| Jaffa | But we'll leave the rest of the detail to the web design meeting (tomorrow, IIRC) | 15:56 |
| bergie | Jaffa: yes, but I think those tasks should be in the April list :-) | 15:57 |
| Jaffa | bergie: we'll get on to committing in a moment, but OK :) | 15:58 |
| Jaffa | So, X-Fade, downloads? | 15:58 |
| Jaffa | I assume "redesign" here is different to the visual design? | 15:58 |
| X-Fade | I want to implement better sync functionality with Extras. | 15:59 |
| X-Fade | And have in fact part of it ready to be deployed. | 15:59 |
| X-Fade | It is different from the visual design, yes. | 16:00 |
| X-Fade | https://wiki.maemo.org/Task:Downloads_catalog_improvements | 16:01 |
| Jaffa | Is it carrying over, then (with specific deliverables and a due date)? | 16:01 |
| X-Fade | I want to do most items of that list. | 16:02 |
| X-Fade | Apart from the reporting back, as we need Nokia to implement that in the Application Manager ;) | 16:02 |
| Jaffa | OK | 16:02 |
| Jaffa | andre___: Bugzilla changes seems to be your only task in the March sprint? | 16:03 |
| andre___ | hey, yeah. and i still haven't really broken that task up into subtasks, grumble. my status: apart from the usual stuff (triaging, syncing, cleaning up, discussing, Feature Jar, internal reports, ... etc) there's my long-term bug 3846 (List Maemo Bugzilla custom code changes). | 16:03 |
| andre___ | I'm basically done with going through all the code changes (and prioritizing them). I've started setting up a local test system and creating patchsets so we don't run into the same issue again next time | 16:03 |
| andre___ | Probably "Creating Patchset of custom Bugzilla code changes (for bug 3846)" is a way more maintainable subtask that I can get done by 80% for the next sprint. | 16:03 |
| andre___ | Still a few things to sort out though (probably need to ping Ferenc next week) | 16:03 |
| Jaffa | OK | 16:04 |
| Jaffa | jeremiah_: adapt lintian; and reducing number of external repos | 16:05 |
| jeremiah_ | No work on adapting lintian unfortunately. | 16:05 |
| jeremiah_ | I have contacted a couple people from ITt regarding repos | 16:05 |
| jeremiah_ | But I also have an email I would like to run by the council before I send | 16:06 |
| tekojo | jeremiah_: I need to talk to you about that, maybe can help a bit | 16:06 |
| tekojo | the lintian stuff | 16:06 |
| jeremiah_ | Sort of a general "please consider moving your repo to maemo.org" email | 16:06 |
| jeremiah_ | tekojo: Cool. :) | 16:06 |
| qole | jeremiah_: would you be responsible for copying apps from the Chinook extras repo to Diablo? There's a few that are Chinook-only and I don't see why... | 16:06 |
| jeremiah_ | I have a git repo set up on garage for lintian (maemian) and have been in touch with upstream. | 16:06 |
| qole | Is this an application developer task only? | 16:07 |
| jeremiah_ | qole: Well, I have been working on moving diablo fremantle, | 16:07 |
| jeremiah_ | I didn't know there were chinook -> diablo apps left. | 16:07 |
| qwerty12 | qole, unfortunately, chinook repo existed before the autobuilder and this means that a lot of free apps are without source... | 16:07 |
| qole | There are just some apps (like Xournal) stuck in Chinook for some reason | 16:07 |
| qole | qwerty12: thanks | 16:08 |
| jeremiah_ | I think the build process is a little convoluted frankly, but that may be a discussion for another day. | 16:08 |
| qwerty12 | qole, anidel had a version built for diablo but it worked really badly and he asked X-Fade to remove it. This is also an example of one of the apps without source for chinook :( | 16:08 |
| qole | ok move along :) | 16:08 |
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| jeremiah_ | So am I to understand that people do not think it worth trying to move packages from chinook to diablo, fremantle? | 16:09 |
| Jaffa | Is there a specific deliverable for "Task:Reducing number..." and/or a due date. It now seems to be an ongoing task | 16:09 |
| Jaffa | jeremiah_: I think it's very worth it | 16:10 |
| jeremiah_ | Jaffa: I can create a specific task, i.e. send an email. | 16:10 |
| qole | jeremiah_: I think it would be wonderful, but qwerty12 says it may be very difficult for some | 16:10 |
| * timsamoff thinks it's a good idea too. | 16:10 | |
| Jaffa | That's where the debmaster comes in to help them :) | 16:10 |
| jeremiah_ | I will investigate, already in diablo I can see that there is a lack of source packages | 16:10 |
| qole | Jaffa: right! | 16:10 |
| jeremiah_ | so if the chinook situation is worse it might take a while. :) | 16:11 |
| qwerty12 | Oh, I think it would be great but I'm just saying that difficulties may be met. Also, flite for example, isn't properly packaged (a deb done with dpkg-deb) | 16:11 |
| * qole slaps his own head | 16:11 | |
| jeremiah_ | It would be really cool if there was some kind of ITP mechanism so that I might get a queue and pick items off it. | 16:11 |
| jeremiah_ | ITP == Intent To Package, debian work flow | 16:12 |
| Jaffa | jeremiah: so (and this is getting on to specific items for this sprint) it sounds like one might be to update X-Fade's original list of external repos and another to re-contact any outstanding ones. | 16:12 |
| Jaffa | Finally, for the record - dneary's update is at http://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo.org_Sprints/April_09/Meeting#Dave_Neary.27s_status_report | 16:12 |
| jeremiah_ | Jaffa: That is my plan, plus I have an email I would like to send to them to motivate the transfer of their private repos to maemo.org | 16:12 |
| Jaffa | Cool. | 16:13 |
| Jaffa | So, April sprint tasks. | 16:13 |
| bergie | I have two new ones | 16:13 |
| qole | The best place to start for a list of external repositories is here: http://www.gronmayer.com/it/ | 16:13 |
| Jaffa | Everyone can shout out specific tasks they are going to commit to, with a due date (prefably the end of this sprint to prevent sprawling work) | 16:13 |
| X-Fade | qole: It is all in the wiki page. ;) | 16:14 |
| Jaffa | One line per line item and it can be sorted out on the wiki later :) | 16:14 |
| Jaffa | So far, we've had: | 16:14 |
| bergie | We're currently doing another round of performance tuning with the Midgard setup on Maemo.org | 16:14 |
| Jaffa | Hirvinen: Karma for applications proposal (April) | 16:15 |
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| Jaffa | Hirvinen: Karam for applications implementation if proposal approved (April) | 16:15 |
| jeremiah_ | porting packages from diablo -> fremantle | 16:15 |
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| keesj | until now I see web + debian stuff , is there a part about summit/community/mer support? | 16:15 |
| Jaffa | Mer has its own sprints | 16:15 |
| danielwilms | I have worked last month on the SSO concept and after discussing with tekojo and bergie we want to setup a testing environment for it with all the important used tools until end of may | 16:15 |
| Jaffa | keesj: do you want to give an update on the summit stuff in AOB? | 16:15 |
| keesj | ok | 16:16 |
| X-Fade | keesj: Summit stuff can be included in this sprint of course! | 16:16 |
| Jaffa | dneary gave a little update, but specific stuff to be committed to: now 's the time to say | 16:16 |
| * Jaffa is not committing to anything in this sprint | 16:16 | |
| Jaffa | Another one we've already had: qgil - maemo.nokia.com text | 16:17 |
| qole | I'm going to clean up http://wiki.maemo.org/Alternative_operating_systems and link it to qgil's Open Source Proofs page instead of the stuff that is there now. | 16:17 |
| Jaffa | And bergie/lauri/X-Fade: newstyle for maemo.org on live site | 16:18 |
| jeremiah_ | danielwilms: I would love to check your testing environment out, is that possible? | 16:18 |
| Jaffa | And bergie/lauri/X-Fade: newstyle for downloads on live site | 16:18 |
| Jaffa | And bergie/lauri/X-Fade: newstyle for bugzilla developed | 16:18 |
| danielwilms | when it is ready, yes ;) | 16:18 |
| jeremiah_ | cool | 16:18 |
| bergie | Jaffa: Neithan/X-Fade, not "bergie/lauri/X-Fade" :-) | 16:18 |
| * Jaffa was going to ask for exactly one owner on them | 16:18 | |
| Jaffa | So not even Neithan/X-Fade | 16:18 |
| bergie | I guess X-Fade is the task owner | 16:19 |
| danielwilms | jeremiah_: goal is that it should work end of may...just discussed what we should use for it | 16:19 |
| Jaffa | X-Fade: any objection? (5... | 16:19 |
| Jaffa | ...4 | 16:19 |
| Jaffa | ...3 | 16:19 |
| Jaffa | ...2 | 16:19 |
| X-Fade | Well.. | 16:19 |
| jeremiah_ | heh | 16:19 |
| X-Fade | All the other themes will probably be on my plate. | 16:19 |
| X-Fade | Unless somebody want to help out ;) | 16:20 |
| X-Fade | There is nothing secret about a bugzilla theme or gforge theme.. | 16:20 |
| X-Fade | It just has to be done. | 16:20 |
| qole | One task owner doesn't mean "doing it without any help", just "one point of responsibility" | 16:20 |
| Jaffa | X-Fade: commit to them at a later date, and try to find a helper | 16:21 |
| Jaffa | qole: what he said | 16:21 |
| X-Fade | Jaffa: Yeah, so point it to me. I'll redistribute the load, if I can ;) | 16:21 |
| danielwilms | X-Fade: let's discuss separately how I can help out there | 16:21 |
| Jaffa | Cool | 16:21 |
| Jaffa | anyone else committing to anything in this sprint? | 16:21 |
| timsamoff | I think we need to make Testing newstyle a specific task... Unless I missed that above. | 16:22 |
| timsamoff | I can commit (as should others). | 16:22 |
| Jaffa | timsamoff: you going to own it? | 16:22 |
| timsamoff | Yes. | 16:22 |
| Jaffa | (since you implicitly already have) | 16:22 |
| Jaffa | Cool. It's also a dependency for launching it then :) | 16:22 |
| timsamoff | Right. :p | 16:22 |
| Jaffa | keesj: going to commit (with dneary) on a summit venue? | 16:23 |
| jeremiah_ | tekojo: Should I email you about lintian / maemian? | 16:23 |
| Jaffa | Not that I should be pushing/suggesting in my facilitation role *cough* | 16:23 |
| tekojo | jeremiah_: please do, I am forgetting too many things these days | 16:23 |
| jeremiah_ | tekojo: heh, I know the feeling. :) | 16:24 |
| Jaffa | OK, we'll move on to AOB. Anyone who wants to commit to things in this sprint at a later date can do so on the wiki page: http://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo.org_Sprints/April_09 | 16:24 |
| keesj | Jaffa: roles have not been defined yet. it looks like I already did the ground work , quim's gonna take the call by visiting 3 selected locations | 16:24 |
| Jaffa | keesj: true | 16:25 |
| Jaffa | OK, we'll leave it with dneary to own and we & Quim can help as required | 16:25 |
| bergie | Jaffa: one more... the Ideastorm | 16:25 |
| bergie | that will be implemented during April | 16:25 |
| Jaffa | bergie: the whole thing (i.e. running one)? | 16:26 |
| bergie | yes... http://wiki.maemo.org/Task:Maemo_brainstorm | 16:26 |
| bergie | and owner is Oskari | 16:26 |
| bergie | (NetBlade on IRC) | 16:27 |
| Jaffa | Cool, thanks | 16:27 |
| Jaffa | In terms of AOB I know of two people with them: keesj on where we are with the summit (mostly summarised above) and qole | 16:28 |
| qole | Ok, for the "Any Other Business" section on the meeting, I have two questions / requests. | 16:28 |
| Jaffa | keesj: anything to add above the "groundwork done, qgil visiting 3 locations? | 16:28 |
| * qole sits back and waits :) | 16:28 | |
| keesj | yes well we have a new possible location the westergasfabriek , that looks very promissing | 16:29 |
| keesj | other then that I think we need to push to at least have a location withing one month I would say. | 16:29 |
| keesj | The other thing is Google Summer Of Code , do we need to do something more about that? | 16:30 |
| keesj | That's it for me | 16:31 |
| qole | I'm almost out of time (must eat breakfast and go to work) so I'm going to jump in with my two questions | 16:32 |
| qole | My first request is that the activity log align as closely as possible with the tasks portion of the page. I would like the activity reporters to reference specific tasks with each activity report, and any non-task activity needs to be clearly marked as such | 16:32 |
| Jaffa | OK, we'll do qole's AOB - and then ask if VDVsx wants to add anything on GSoC | 16:32 |
| keesj | qole: +1 | 16:33 |
| Jaffa | qole++ - making the status reporting more closely tied to the committed tasks, and so easier to read makes sense - and fits with a lot of the "transparency" pushback we're getting now | 16:33 |
| jeremiah_ | Jaffa: transparency pushback? | 16:33 |
| VDVsx | Jaffa, for now, we only need mentors comments and scores :) | 16:33 |
| danielwilms | VDVsx: more mentors needed?? | 16:34 |
| keesj | VDVsx: Do people (me) need to mentor a project and if so what project :p | 16:34 |
| qole | My second question is related: I'm still unclear about the council's role in "policing" the paid maemo.org team. To what extent are we the team's "bosses"? | 16:34 |
| Jaffa | jeremiah_: There's been some grumbling on talk^WITT about the transparency of maemo.org; and it's causing concern about the transition | 16:34 |
| VDVsx | danielwilms, depend in the area of expertise, people to review and score is always welcome | 16:35 |
| jeremiah_ | Jaffa: transition from what to what? The web design? | 16:35 |
| tekojo | qole: the paid people in the community should work for the community | 16:35 |
| Jaffa | jeremiah_: InternetTabletTalk -> talk.maemo.org | 16:35 |
| jeremiah_ | h | 16:35 |
| jeremiah_ | ah | 16:35 |
| VDVsx | keesj, , you are in the backup mentors basket :P, but if you want you can mentor some project that you like | 16:35 |
| tekojo | The sprints are one instance of that | 16:35 |
| Jaffa | There's a worry that maemo.org is a black box and the much-loved forum is going to be damaged irrepairably | 16:36 |
| qole | I agree that the paid people should work for the community. So that means that the Council is the "boss" of the paid team, as elected representatives of the community. | 16:37 |
| Jaffa | I suppose qole's question may be best answered by X-Fade, andre___, jeremiah_ and - largely - bergie. | 16:37 |
| jeremiah_ | qole: I am not so sure that the term "boss" is the one you are looking for. | 16:37 |
| tekojo | qole: boss is a hard word in a community | 16:37 |
| jeremiah_ | Exactly. | 16:37 |
| jeremiah_ | I strongly dislike it. | 16:37 |
| tekojo | qole: but I agree that you should have a strong influence in what the paid team does | 16:37 |
| Jaffa | Certainly, in an agile process like this - things get done because the person committing to it is attached to it - preferably voluntarily | 16:37 |
| andre___ | well, i work for the community, but i call other people "my bosses" :) | 16:38 |
| * timsamoff thinks that's what these Sprints are all about. | 16:38 | |
| qole | Yes, I know, I'm just looking for a word that conveys the "buck stops here" role, when there are performance concerns, etc... | 16:38 |
| timsamoff | We (the community) set the priorities. | 16:38 |
| VDVsx | about GSoC,I'm afraid that we don't have mentors for the get two of the projects (mainlining kernel and OE support), the rest seems ok to me | 16:38 |
| VDVsx | bahh | 16:38 |
| jeremiah_ | qole: Performance concerns? | 16:38 |
| -!- andre___ [n=andre@g1.blanicka25.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] | 16:39 | |
| jeremiah_ | Can you elaborate? | 16:39 |
| tekojo | qole: your second question is an important one | 16:39 |
| qole | I just mean that if someone is getting paid to perform a role, then there needs to be a specific person or persons who can make sure that they are staying on task. | 16:39 |
| keesj | but don't have students for the OE and kernel work (need to go in 5 minutes) | 16:40 |
| jeremiah_ | qole: For that you will have to define the role, define "staying on task" and define to whom that person reports. | 16:40 |
| VDVsx | keesj, we have | 16:40 |
| tekojo | qole: a kind of double model there | 16:40 |
| Jaffa | It sounds like there is a lot of ground to cover, do people want an in-depth discussion now (and I know qole has to go to work, and I need to do more) or shall we take this to the mailing list and/or schedule a separate meeting | 16:41 |
| qole | jeremiah_: Sprints are the tasks, staying on task is doing what was committed, and the "to whom does that person report" is my question | 16:41 |
| jeremiah_ | qole: So you feel there is somehow something missing in the current implementation? | 16:42 |
| jeremiah_ | I think the only sustainable model is the community. | 16:43 |
| tekojo | qole: as for hours, I see the time spent, but I would like to measure the impact of work, and there the community is the best judge | 16:43 |
| qole | Yes, the "to whom does that person report" part | 16:43 |
| jeremiah_ | And that model si flat. | 16:43 |
| jeremiah_ | People have to work on things they are interested in. | 16:43 |
| Jaffa | tekojo: agreed. I'd also like to see better tracking against committed tasks and a hard "is it done? yes/no" model for every task | 16:43 |
| jeremiah_ | They won't volunteer otherwise. :) | 16:43 |
| qole | I guess the positions come up for review every six months? Can a performance review be scheduled at that point? | 16:43 |
| qole | jeremiah_: I am not talking about volunteers, only paid employees | 16:44 |
| tekojo | qole: I think that is an idea worth looking into in more detail | 16:44 |
| jeremiah_ | If that is to be implemented, the council needs to define the roles much more carefully | 16:44 |
| qole | yes, doesn't have to be discussed to completion here and now, perhaps a sprint task? To be assigned to quim? | 16:45 |
| tekojo | assign to me | 16:45 |
| Jaffa | tekojo: thanks | 16:45 |
| jeremiah_ | And make the reporting explicit. | 16:45 |
| * timsamoff says qole's Q2 should be moved to mailing list... His Q1 was never really addressed. | 16:45 | |
| timsamoff | Thanks, tekojo. | 16:45 |
| qole | Yes I have to go now, so my questions need to be addressed elsewhere, I guess | 16:46 |
| Jaffa | Yes: action to all with committed tasks, and reporting activity: this should reference a task explicitly, or state otherwise | 16:46 |
| tekojo | timsamoff: Q2 is a big and complex issue, with a lot of viewpoint | 16:46 |
| Jaffa | I hope no-one objects to that (I have a stick) | 16:46 |
| -!- andre___ [n=andre@g1.blanicka25.net] has joined #maemo-meeting | 16:46 | |
| * qole doesn't object | 16:46 | |
| timsamoff | tekojo: I understand. | 16:46 |
| andre___ | (grmpf. sorry. my X server crashed) | 16:47 |
| qole | thanks all, must go | 16:47 |
| Jaffa | Thanks all. X-Fade: are you responsible for getting the logs online? | 16:48 |
| jeremiah_ | I think you should address these issues directly with the paid staff so that there is no misunderstandings qole and Jaffa | 16:48 |
| X-Fade | Jaffa: Will do. | 16:48 |
| Jaffa | jeremiah_: Will do, if you like. | 16:48 |
| tekojo | jeremiah_: that's where the different point's of view come in :-) | 16:48 |
| -!- qole [n=qole@d207-6-250-238.bchsia.telus.net] has quit ["Leaving"] | 16:49 | |
| Jaffa | I'd hope that community volunteers reporting status would do the same, but I will make it explicit that it's expected of paid staff if you'd like | 16:49 |
| Jaffa | (unless there are reasonable objections as to why it's a bad idea) | 16:49 |
| Jaffa | X-Fade: thanks | 16:49 |
| jeremiah_ | I think it is too much to ask of volunteers to be beholden to the council. | 16:49 |
| Jaffa | jeremiah_: agreed | 16:49 |
| jeremiah_ | That road leads to frustration. | 16:49 |
| Jaffa | And I don't think qole's suggesting that :) | 16:49 |
| Jaffa | X-Fade: once the minutes are up, I'll pull out as many of the identified tasks for this sprint as I can and send it round as a draft sprint plan | 16:50 |
| jeremiah_ | I was not referring to qole. | 16:50 |
| Jaffa | ...or me, then | 16:50 |
| Jaffa | Thanks all. Back to the day-job. | 16:50 |
| tekojo | Jaffa: thanks! | 16:51 |
| timsamoff | Thanks, Jaffa! | 16:51 |
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